July 28, 2008

Law Inforcement Theory and Known Connections

Many of the victims have ties to law inforcement or the justice system. Some readers have been speculating about the possibility of law enforcement being involved, or that family members of law enforcement being targeted.

In response to your comments, here is a list of facts I've found:
  • Anthony Skifton is the nephew and godson of La Crosse, Wisconsin police Lt. Dan Marcou.
  • Matthew Kruziki is the son of a former Wisconsin sheriff and the current US Marshal for the Eastern District of Wisconsin.
  • Christopher Nordby is the son of Hennepin County, Minnesota District Judge Jack Nordby.
  • Keith Ryan's father is a retired Decatur, Illinois police detective.
  • Tony Luzio's father is a 31-year veteran of the Columbus, Ohio police.
In addition, the following young men had run-ins with the police before they disappeared:
  • 12/23/05: Matt Kruziki, 24, Dubuque, IA
  • 01/12/05: Chris Thiem, 19, Vincennes, IN
  • 09/12/04: Jesse Miller, 21, Eau Claire, WI
  • 10/31/03: Matthew Schiess, 17, McConnell, IL
  • 02/22/98: Nathan Kapfer, 19, La Crosse, WI
  • 03/10/01: Justin Hayduk, 18, Morgantown, WV was almost picked up by law enforcement at West Virginia University for underage drinking on the night he disappeared.
Readers - feel free to post your comments/findings about a possible connection in the comments section under this post.


Anonymous said...

Justin Hayduk went missing after running from police during a traffic stop.

Anonymous said...

Chris Jenkins GF was hanging out w/ some MN cops the night Chris went missing.

Anonymous said...


And here are some other connections (direct and indirect) with the police.

1.Nick Rossini-had a DUI the previous night before going missing

2.Jesse Miller-police watched as he went into the river and drowned

3.Josh Snell-reported he thought he was in trouble with law enforcement and later on his cell phone told a friend he was scared, someone was after him, then drowned

4.Chris Jenkins-was kicked out of a bar in which 2 off duty policemen were at. These police befriended Chris's girlfriend and one police man gave her a ride home. Chris drowned that same evening.

5.Cullen Fortney-the friend he was with the night he disappeared called the police to report that his truck had been stolen. Cullen went missing same night.

6.Glenn Leadley-police were notified he was walking erratically but they were unable to locate him.Later found drowned.

7.Patrick Welsh-the cell phone he left behind when he went missing was used by a man who police later arrested for assualt in an unrelated case.

The connection to Law enforcement is so obvious. Is it possible the killer uses a police scanner to locate his next victim? A cop impersonator? A man using a campus security uniform?

I rule out active law enforcement officers based on there is no way to have so many cop killers. In fact, there is a possibility the killer has something against law enforcement.

There is some validity to this in that so many of the boys that went missing and drowned had an incident in one form or another with the police.

Does this killer leave smiley faces? I'm not sure but concentrating on the connection to Law Enforcement.

BoyintheMachine said...

Att: Anonymous 1,

I see you are focusing on 1 killer.

I see you are also relunctant to include actual cops.

Unfortuantely there are some bad cops. (A while back I watched a documentary about a cop that was having a homosexual affair with a very young guy and then killed him to prevent anybody from knowing.)

If these deaths are murders, then the 1 killer theory was ruled out ages ago. There is simply no way for the killer to be able to travel so fast.

With regards to the bad cop scenario, cops would know that the water would destroy evidence of a murder. In a murder investigation, the last people the person interacted with are very important. Many of these guys had run ins with the cops before disappearing. In an investiagion, it would be normal to pursue such theory.

However, first comes proving these deaths to be murders. Next comes proving the murders to be interconnected. Finally comes looking at suspects.

I think people forget that only one of these deaths has been changed to homicide. (Patrick McNeil will most likely be changed as well.) The detectives claim they have evidence for many more, but they don't claim they have proof for every single one. (I think they stated like 12 on the podcast.) We will have to wait and see.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous 1

There has to be a connection between these boys drowning because of statistics. So, I think some of them can almost be assumed to be murders.(a stretch I know).But let's just say they are not accidents because the stats are getting too great. The p value(significance) keeps getting smaller so statistically it is becoming more significant.

Why not one killer who travels for work (maybe works on furnaces in winter months in Midwest and East coast-not unusual sales territories either). Hypothesis: Some of the boys have been murdered.Some are connected while others are not (and we don't know) How do you rule out 1 killer who uses a police scanner for info. and drugs?

2 retired cops that are brothers?(Brother's bar?)

It can't be a gang-they talk too much for bragging rights and having more than one or two people typically doesn't last. One screws up,one talks, etc. per John Douglas (Profiler).

Can you tell me how it can't be one killer if the hypothesis is accepted?

BoyintheMachine said...

Att: Anonymous 1,

The connection at this point is alcohol. Factor in lone drunk male pedestrians in locations near bodies of water = trouble.

I don't know why people act like drunk people don't drown.

It's normal for friends and family of victims not to accept the simply explanation in favor of a conspiracy, as many might think it shameful to think their loved one died from an accident while intoxicated. However, if you watch Dr. G Medical Examiner, you will realize that she states several times that young males are far more likely to die from accidents, and especialy while intoxicated and/or on drugs. (There's one case about a young man who decides to hold down a mattres on a car by laying on top of it while a friend drove. You guessed it, he died. Then again there was a news story about a girl who died on her birthday. She was riding with her friends and they were drunk. She opened up the car door on the highway and went out, and yes, she died too. The theory is that while intoxicated she needed to pee and forget they were driving down the highway.)

Don't get me wrong, I'm open to the idea of a group of killers targeting college-age men, but let's not throw out logic and reason.

If these are murders then it would have to be multiple people. Some of these guys vanished on the same date, just hundreds of miles apart. There is simply no way in the world that one person can travel that fast.

It may be a real street-gang. It's certainly a possibility. Most thugs and such hate snitches and narcs. Bad things tend to happen to those who squeal.

Then again there are known groups that are extremely secretive.

Th 'bad cops' and cop impersonator hypothesis are valid lines of reasoning if these are indeed murders. I would also suspect that if this was the case then the cops might have intelligence and/or military background, or at least have some afiliation with a group, fraternity, society, club, etc..with a similar mindset where this sort of thing is viewed as acceptable. Perhaps similar to an 'honor killing'.

Forget about the brothers/brother's bar connection. People don't think like that.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous 1

If we say two boys in different places so it has to be more than one killer we are assuming both are murders and are connected.

But let's just say one is an accident(as some have to be) and one is a murder. They would not be connected and so the possibility could be 1 killer.

I am not yet convinced that all of the boys were murdered and I haven't ruled out some were accidents. The question is which are connected and how? I agree, it is a lone male who is intoxicated and near water (and with in 100 mi. of I-94 in the Midwest.) I also see a significant number of these boys having a run in with police. So, I'm trying to connect this.(have you seen Josh Szostak's video? The police car slowly going by him?)
I can't rule out a bad cop but several of the victims (if including them as being connected, had a father who was a cop.)

I agree, the killer/killers are educated about crime and how to evade the law, organized, have a background as you stated,and highly methodical.

There are no other theories I see as being as convincing as the law enforcement connection. I am not convinced at this point that: Religion, Graffiti, Gangs, Satanic cults, etc. are a connection. It would make these murders more sensational but think it might be as simple as a loner. One guy 40-50s, seen as nice but quiet, white, travels (organized) for work, blends in....it's simple but more believable to me. Maybe has a uniform, a scanner and uses some type of drug that evades common detection of a simple tox. screen used at deaths that appear to be accidents until an autopsy is done.

Think it's one guy or 2 guys (dominant/subordinate) and that why it has been able to last for so many years.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous 1

And Dr. G rocks! Watch it a lot. Wish she did the autopsies with the idea something sinister was going on. Then we'd get a full, all inclusive tox. screen.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous 1

It would be interesting to try to determine if there is a connection with all the deaths by very objective means.

The means would be it was there (or may have been there,possible connection) every single time.

Eg. Intoxicated male, seperated from friends (alone),found drowned in water and other striking similarities as police contact(of course LOL). Circunstances would have to be very much the same (not graffiti here but not there, or not found yet, not electrocuted in room etc.) It would also be interesting to see how many were in need of a ride.
I only mention this in that seems many of the boys were needing a ride. (A while back I was seperated from friends and a cop gave me a ride home. I remember him offering and thought it was nice...but to an underage male or a male with a record it would mean RUN!)

Any ideas on what should be included in proving the theory (to some degree) they are connected?

Very open minded here.

Anonymous said...

Maybe the cops are trying to keep the investigation quiet, and "police" themselves.

Can you imagine what the public reaction would be to announcing that police officers were suspected/involved in serial murders?

Maybe someone really has commited the perfect murder?

Anonymous said...

Anonymous 1

As I said, drugged by a man in a uniform and then the uniforms are chasing you down. Who would choose death over being arrested? What instills such a desperate fear that one would rather die than be taken by cops? Easy answer...

monique777 said...

Date rape drug=Rohypnol=GHB

"They are not found in any routine toxicology screen or blood tests- doctors and police have to be looking specifically for them."
Once ingested they are very fast acting and leave the body after 72 hrs.

So an impersonator using GHB makes sense.


monique777 said...

Watch Kristi Piehl, Gannon and Duarte on April 24,2009 plead to have the FBI have drownings reinvestigated as they tell of their findings.


monique777 said...

Congressman calls on FBI to reopen drowning cases on 4/24/2009


In due time a connection will be made due to the public's out cry for justice!

BoyintheMachine said...


That link is from 2008, prior to Kristi Piehl being laid off.

BoyintheMachine said...


Again, this is old information. The FBI recieved 3 letters (I think) from congressmen and the FBI responded that there is no evidence to support the serial killer(s) theory.

monique777 said...

It was a bit misleading but you're right...I checked it out. Sorry about that people!

So, any new ideas on how we can objectively connect each drowning case?

BoyintheMachine said...


How to connect each case, assuming they have been proved to be murders:

1.) same specific injuries to the body.
2.) same drug/substance found at autopsy.
3.) same witness description
4.) same vehicle description

What doesn't count as proof:

Unfortuantley just about all the speculation about graffiti, 'anti-Christian' and other things.

Possible suggestion:

Civilian undercover watches? -People scoping out bars, inside and out, blending in hopes of catching anything suspicious?

It would be long and tedious, but it's a possibility. Probably fruitless, but a possibility no-less.

It should be done by individuals relatively close to the targetted age group.

monique777 said...

Interesting although there's a problem with 3) same drug. My friend who is a DA said post mortem toxicology uses a basic panel, unless the police beleive there is foul play. It is too expensive to run an extensive panel at every autopsy. Also, with this being said GHB (gamma hydroxy butyrate) or the "date rape drug" isn't looked for in a basic tox. panel. So, the police would have to suspect it as being foul play to have this tested for. I also ran this by my DA friend and he said it's true although they are now starting to test more frequently for GHB in females dying in suspicious manners but not in a death the police suspect as being an accident. He said the medical examiner gets all the police reports before performing the autopsy.

I also thought maybe when alcohol is involved the case doesn't get the same treatment by detectives and in his opinion he said this is not true. The investigations would be equal although I question this.

Toxicology testing can be very expensive and counties can't eat the cost unless the police suspect foul play and that the victim was drugged. Then it is done obviously.

If I were 21 y/o I would go to places looking for suspicious activity or sit outside with a police scanner. Maybe I should get out of health care and go to school to become a PI.

Initially I discounted the idea that it could be a person/s in law enforcement however there is that possibility.Could explain why they are being ruled accidents if a connection does exist.Far fetched though. At this point don't believe it is a working cop/cops.

We can't control the autopsy,there never seems to be a witness or a vehicle. All of this theory of a connection between the victims would be proved if that information was there! (Man this killer/killers are slick if he/they exist!)

I was thinking more along the lines of out of the 197 or so drownings, what could be used as criteria to either have them connected or not connected. We don't have hard evidence to work with, just the facts that were released in the media to work with.

For example: I would not link any case because of graffiti because it's seldomly there. Nor christian themes because so few of them were missing a christian necklace and the majority of Americans are christians so of course the majority of victims I suspect are christians.(and criminals for that matter).

I'm thinking more along the lines of examining all drownings, not just the 40 on this site and find some criteria that might possibly connect them. Eg. Age, sex, run-ins with cops,time of night/day, circunstances,ending up in water and other objective facts. Then do a statistical analysis and see if it's significant.

I am convinced there is a connection so it would probably bias my findings. As you already know I am convinced there is a connection to police.

Any ideas on other criteria to include/not include? Race? Time of year? Physical descriptions?

Ideas are welcome.

Lisa said...

I stumbled across this article about a possible suspiciouspolicemanin TN.

monique777 said...

Thanks Lisa.

This is an interesting read. Sounds like a lot of covering up by the cop and why didn't he follow standard procedure! It all sounds very fishy...a cop picking up someone with out calling it in? Not doing a background? And even more suspicious is the cop returns to the car and searches it afterwards? Why? Where was his warrant or reason for doing so.

Why didn't the cop radio in that there was a man with car trouble? Or was the car fine and the cop pulled him over without calling it in? Searched his car, put him in the backseat and then released him at Circle K only to hunt him down?


Anonymous said...

Lisa - VERY interesting article you found.

Monique777 good detective work. I think ALL the cases should be looked at and not just the ones that we think fit the mo/profile.

monique777 said...

I agree. There are large periods of time (eg.5/12/98 to 4/13/99) where no one goes missing.If there is a killer, doesn't make sense unless the killer is in jail or there are other cases that should be included that aren't on this site.
Think this killer is too smart to end up in jail for a year. He is too cautious, too methodical and organized.

Anonymous said...

Or they could have had a change of routine, hospitalization, sick family member or work related training. Just a thought.

Anonymous said...

News:May 7,2009

Ryan Eback, 27 y/o jumped in the Souris River on April 16,2009 after he was stopped on suspicion of drunken driving. His body was just found in the river.

Another man jumps to his death to avoid the police?

Anonymous said...

Ezra Milan,22 y/o went missing 3/11/09 after being out with a friend.Body found in water.


Another run in with police before going missing!

Anonymous said...

Authorities say the fishermen on Sunday found the body of Jeffrey McCormick. The man was last seen fleeing police after a traffic stop on March 22 by jumping into Pekin Lake. Police say there were warrants for McCormick's arrest on misdemeanor charges.

Anonymous said...

Police say a 21-year-old Winona Lake man drowned in a channel of Irish Lake near North Webster while trying to get away from officers. Jarred Lee Neibert had been wanted on a warrant for theft and burglary.

Anonymous said...

PRINCE FREDERICK, Md. (Aug. 1, 2008) -- Police in Calvert County on Thursday announced that their investigation in the drowning death of Demetrius Lamar Hall, age 26, of Lusby on May 5 was complete. The conclusion is that Hall drowned accidentally of his own accord and police officers were not involved, despite allegations from family members to the contrary.

Monique777 said...

And these are just the ones we know about. Consider we don't know what happened after they went missing. They could have had a run-in with police for underage drinking. Also, one victim's car was in a ditch. He began walking. Now, if a cop sees a car in a ditch he's going to call it in and check it out. After that he'll keep driving along until he runs into the owner who is walking. Another potential run-in with police.
The scary part is these are just the victims we know had a run in with police. But a lot of time can elapse after they go missing which leaves time to run into the police.
It could be the killer uses a police scanner to track his victims. Maybe this is what the killer means when he says "you can't see what you're not looking for." Seems almost as if he wants to set the cops up.

monique777 said...

The investigation into the death of Brian Dietrich in 1993 is being reopened.

Brian Dietrich disappeared after being out at Schooner's Bar. He was found drowned in the Mississippi River.

He is the son of a local sheriff.


monique777 said...

Another man jumps to his death while being sought by police:

A 38 y/o New Albany man named Stanley Huffman was driving a stolen box truck. When NAPD tried to stop the vehicle Huffman got out of the truck and jumped off the Sherman Minton Bridge into the Ohio river. Six days later the body was found near the Horseshoe Casino near the Louisville shore. Police said Huffman had no outstanding warrants.


Monique777 said...

Jeremy Lum, 29, was found drowned in the San Joaquin River after being released by police for public intoxication. After his release from jail at 12:30 no one saw him until he turned up in the river drown.


Lisa said...

A police impersonator was reported in East Lansing, Michigan in 2001. It was the 4th report of an impersonator since 1999. The full article by the State News is below:

Police release sketch of imposter officer
By Jamie Gumbrecht
(Last updated: 08/28/09 5:48pm)

While East Lansing’s Police Department includes a force of about 70 members, at least one officer on the city streets isn’t carrying a valid badge.

A sketch has been released of the suspect in a police impersonation incident last Thursday on Marfitt Road, near the Lake Lansing Meijer.

Police describe the suspect as a white male, 5-foot-11 to 6-foot-2, about 200 pounds, with medium-length brown or black hair, medium build and possibly in his late 20s to early 30s.

He was wearing a dark blue, long-sleeve police shirt, uniform pants and a Garrison-style cap.

This is the fourth time since 1999 a police impersonator has been reported in East Lansing.

“It’s kind of unique really,” East Lansing police Lt. Kim Johnson said. “People do it every now and then, but to this extent, it’s very unique.”

Johnson said detectives in the case believe this suspect to be the same who appeared in the first incident in 1999.

Since then, all East Lansing police officers are required to carry a photo ID with their badges.

Also, while the suspect’s costume is similar to East Lansing’s standard uniform, the outfit is missing shoulder patches and the car lacks proper markings.

“He must be familiar with the area to do this at least twice in a few years,” Johnson said. “This person could be mobile, so we’re looking around the state. There’s not rhyme or reason to it.”

Lansing police Lt. Ray Hall said he has never heard of a police impersonation case in Lansing.

“It’s extremely rare to see an impersonator,” Hall said. “We’ve had people identify themselves as police officers but not with a full uniform and vehicle.”

While the crime may be rare, Hall said it wouldn’t be difficult to commit when someone is determined.

“You can order patches and badges off the Internet,” he said. “You can buy a uniform at any costume shop. We’ve never seen a fully marked patrol car, but we’ve seen people attempt to come close.”

The general manager at Dimondale’s Adesa Lansing, an automobile auction and resale service, said used police cars pass through the business.

While all of the vehicles are sold only to dealers, other auctioning services can put police-style cars before the public.

Hall said if there is any suspicion that a police impersonator is attempting to pull a car over, the driver shouldn’t pull over until they’ve reached a well-lit, public area.

“We tell our citizens, especially in times like this, not to pull over for unmarked cars,” he said. “The types of situations in East Lansing are helping to get the message out.”

Anyone with information about the police impersonator can contact the East Lansing Police Department tipline at (800) ELPD-TIP.

Originally Published: 08/15/01 12:00am

Jordan said...

I don't know if the death of Jacob Hobson (July 2005, Ames, Iowa) is on this blog anywhere, it's on sfkillers.com, but he was cited/arrested for public intoxication in April before his death. I found this info in the Iowa State Police news blotter in The Daily, the campus newspaper.
He was found in College Creek in a few inches of water.

Another link to the police.

Jordan said...

Des Moines, Iowa: DM police warn of possible impersonators after uniforms stolen.

Read Article Here: http://www.radioiowa.com/2009/10/08/dm-police-warn-of-possible-impersonators-after-uniforms-stolen/